Travel Mapping

Highway Data Discussion => In-progress Highway Systems & Work => Completed Highway Systems Threads => Topic started by: michih on June 15, 2016, 04:38:46 pm

Title: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on June 15, 2016, 04:38:46 pm
http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?sys=deub

The tier-4 system deub is my first system. The network has a length of almost 40,000km (B1 to B999 with a lot of gaps).
Si has checked the some draft files and said that they "seem perfectly acceptable".

I've already completed B1 to B89 now except B28 and B28 (because it should be rerouted in "Mid 2016" but I couldn't find any reliable info how it should be changed and it's still discussed, no final decision) and a short B32 section which is directly affected by the B28 rededication.

I think it's time to have a peer-review to avoid having to do a lot of rework before the system could be activated one day.
Is there any experienced volunteer how could peer-review my first batch?

I could split the system like usaky and put deub1 (e.g. B1-B99) to preview? (it would also help me to see the completed routes on a map)


The most up-to-date map showing all routes is this: https://mobil.hessen.de/sites/mobil.hessen.de/files/content-downloads/EntwurfBVWP2030-Stra%C3%9Fe.png (6MB, it's just a copy from the Federal Ministry of Transport, the original file size has 90MB (http://www.bmvi.de/DE/VerkehrUndMobilitaet/Verkehrspolitik/Verkehrsinfrastruktur/Bundesverkehrswegeplan2030/InhalteHerunterladen/inhalte_node.html), the colored routes are the projects of the future demand plan showing). The problem with deub is that a lot of routes are announced to be rededicated to regional roads but it's not 100% clear what's already done. It's planned since the 1980s, it was finally agreed in 2011 and most of them have been "downgraded" in 2015.

In additon to the map mentioned above, I've checked detailed online data (maps) from the state's road authorities to figure out the exact route:

BB: http://isk.geobasis-bb.de/strassennetz/basiskarte.html
BE: http://fbinter.stadt-berlin.de/fb/index.jsp?loginkey=showMap&mapId=k_vms_detailnetz_wms_spatial@senstadt
BW: http://www.svz-bw.de/verkehrszaehlung.html
BY: https://www.baysis.bayern.de/webgis/synserver?project=webgis
HB: no direct link
HE: https://mobil.hessen.de/%C3%BCber-uns/downloads-formulare/netzknotenkarten-hessen
HH: http://www.hamburg.de/bwvi/start-hauptverkehrsstrassennetz/
MV: http://www.laiv-mv.de/land-mv/LAiV_prod/LAiV/AfGVK/Aktuelle_Karten/1250_000/index.jsp#Stra%C3%9Fenkarte
NI: http://www.nwsib-niedersachsen.de/
NW: http://www.nwsib-online.nrw.de/
RP: https://www.lbm.rlp.de/Veroeffentlichungen/Strassenkarte-Rheinland-Pfalz/
SH: http://portal.digitaleratlasnord.de/portal/initParams.do
SL: -
SN: http://geoportal.sachsen.de/cps/karte.html?showmap=true
ST: http://www.geofachdatenserver.de/de/strassen-sachsen-anhalt.html
TH: http://www.thueringen.de/th9/tlbv/service/strassenkarte/
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 15, 2016, 04:45:55 pm
I'm not sure how to handle some routes dedicated identically. I've called them B**Ast (= branch) to avoid self-refering waypoints. I've mentioned it here: https://github.com/TravelMapping/HighwayData/pull/595.

For instance: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b012ast.

Another example is B19: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b019bar.
It's the old B19 route. The bypass (to the east) is dedicated B19 too.
I could just map the new route but B62 ends at B19 because the final B62 section is not yet built.

There's also:
- http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b012bra (ok, it's also part of E road)
- http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b054dor (a ring road with opposing traffic)

Is my way correct or do I have to change it? Which way should I change it?
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 19, 2016, 02:41:43 am
"deub0 (http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?sys=deub0)" (B1 to B99) has preview status now. It's ready for a peer-review!
I'd be happy if an experienced contributor would minimum make a random review.

A minor bug fix is still pending (pull request submitted) about concurrent routes E552/B12 though.

"deub1 (http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?sys=deub1)" (B100+) is in development.

I'm not sure how to handle some routes dedicated identically. I've called them B**Ast (= branch) to avoid self-refering waypoints.
Is my way correct or do I have to change it? Which way should I change it?

I've renamed all to B**AST, for instance
- B12AST: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b012ast
- B19AST: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b019ast
- B54AST: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b054ast
- B54ASTSie: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b054astsie
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: si404 on June 22, 2016, 11:12:59 am
Self-ref labels aren't a huge problem - the key reason why we flag them as errors as it is all too easy to grab waypoints for that route from other .wpts and then not rename them. We usually label signed* branches with a settlement name. Recently I've been adding some sort of note in the city field of the .csvs to say that it's a loop/spur off the mainline, rather than disjointed route segments.

The B44/B47 junction is a mess. I suggest naming B47's 'B44' point for the cross street, and adding a new point where the B roads actually cross (because there's a ramp, making it a junction). The B44 has no business having a point where 'B47' currently is. If there's similar junctions where movements are via a linking road, then points at the link road and no shared point. See France and their many trumpet interchanges for examples elsewhere.

*Unsigned ones don't get added, with few exceptions.
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 22, 2016, 12:33:28 pm
The B44/B47 junction is a mess. I suggest naming B47's 'B44' point for the cross street, and adding a new point where the B roads actually cross (because there's a ramp, making it a junction). The B44 has no business having a point where 'B47' currently is. If there's similar junctions where movements are via a linking road, then points at the link road and no shared point. See France and their many trumpet interchanges for examples elsewhere.

I'm not sure that I got you right. I could just move the B44/B47 waypoint to the actual cross and rename the B47 'B44' waypoint to 'LamStr' but the cross street is dedicated as B road (> click < (https://mobil.hessen.de/sites/mobil.hessen.de/files/content-downloads/SMK_2015_Bensheim_20151204.pdf)). I think I'll call it B44AST, rename the B44 'LamStr' waypoint to 'B44AST' and B47 'B44' waypoint to 'B44AST'. The actual cross will get the 'B44' or 'B47' waypoint for both routes.
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 22, 2016, 12:35:40 pm
In addition, I think I'll bring deub1 (B100-199), deub2 (B200-299), deub3 (B300-399), deub4 (B400-499) and deub5 (B500-999) to preview status too. Step by step... :)

deub1 will be ready soon (just 1 route and 'self-preview' missing).
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: si404 on June 22, 2016, 12:47:35 pm
I'm not sure that I got you right. I could just move the B44/B47 waypoint to the actual cross and rename the B47 'B44' waypoint to 'LamStr' but the cross street is dedicated as B road (> click < (https://mobil.hessen.de/sites/mobil.hessen.de/files/content-downloads/SMK_2015_Bensheim_20151204.pdf)). I think I'll call it B44AST, rename the B44 'LamStr' waypoint to 'B44AST' and B47 'B44' waypoint to 'B44AST'. The actual cross will get the 'B44' or 'B47' waypoint for both routes.
That works (other than what I said about spur routes).
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 22, 2016, 01:24:00 pm
Ok, already done :)
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 22, 2016, 03:12:15 pm
The B44/B47 junction is a mess.
If there's similar junctions where movements are via a linking road, then points at the link road and no shared point. See France and their many trumpet interchanges for examples elsewhere.

A73/B22/B505 just south of Bamberg is a similar mess. I've corrected and completed it with my latest pull request.
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on June 24, 2016, 10:12:18 am
deub1 is also ready for peer-review now: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?sys=deub1!

In total, more than 60%* of deub system is in preview status.

*according to the network length.
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on July 19, 2016, 04:57:55 am
I've completed the draft of the routes. 643 routes in total. I've merged deub0-5 to deub and put it to preview (should be live with the next site update).
According to Si's classification (http://tm.teresco.org/forum/index.php?topic=131.msg1569#msg1569), it's in "preview" status but not yet "ready to review" because I still have to make some general checks, e.g. B28 issue is not yet clear.
Nevertheless, any comment is welcomed :)

In addition, there are some potential "eursf" routes (http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?sys=eursf) which are state roads (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_autobahn%C3%A4hnlicher_Stra%C3%9Fen#Landesstra.C3.9Fen) and district or municipality roads (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_autobahn%C3%A4hnlicher_Stra%C3%9Fen#Kreis-_und_Gemeindestra.C3.9Fen). @Si: Do you think I should added the routes of the list which do really meet the rules?
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: cinx on August 01, 2016, 02:45:55 am
Hi Michi,

I don't see in the list the B13 from A995 to Holzkirchen.
Maybe you can add that to the B13 Bad Tölz?
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on August 01, 2016, 07:12:44 am
I don't see in the list the B13 from A995 to Holzkirchen.
Maybe you can add that to the B13 Bad Tölz?

It's St2573 now, please refer to OSM, BAYSIS (https://www.baysis.bayern.de/webgis/synserver?project=webgis) or info of Bavarian government (https://www.bayern.landtag.de/www/ElanTextAblage_WP17/Drucksachen/Schriftliche%20Anfragen/17_0009204.pdf). I think it was dedicated on 1st January 2016.
More than 500km Bundesstraßen have been downgraded in Bavaria and there are still some to be downgraded.
In total, about 3,000km Bundesstraßen should be downgraded (source (http://www.die-stadtredaktion.de/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/20120524_Ausschussdrs_abzustufende-Bundessstra%C3%9Fen.pdf), I could only find this copy but no official document/link).

I drove "B8" west of Würzburg yesterday which is dedicated St2312 since 1st January 2016. The yellow signs still show "8" but the station signs (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stationszeichen) have already been replaced and show St2312 now. OSM is also finally updated.
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: cinx on August 01, 2016, 07:34:33 am
Thanks for the info, didn't know that :)
Title: Re: German B roads (deub)
Post by: michih on September 04, 2016, 10:26:37 am
I've completed all checks and deub might be ready for review and activation.

However, there are too many announced, expected and unexpected(!) rededications of Bundesstraßen. I think it's currently impossible to state that the network is completely mapped. The major stage of the rededication procedure was planned to be completed by the end of 2015 but it seems that many announced rededications are still not implemented. I'd like to wait till early 2017 for another review before activating the system.

Nevertheless, you're welcome for a peer-review except checking that all relevant Bundesstraßen are included.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: cinx on March 27, 2017, 06:30:00 pm
Where is the B19 from Ulm?
What about B486 to Heidenheim an der Brenz?
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on March 28, 2017, 03:37:48 pm
Where is the B19 from Ulm?

The short segment from A8 Ulm-Ost to B10/B28? It was planned to be rededicated w/o any condition by 2015. I couldn't find any info though. It's still indicated to be 'B19' on GM and OSM. All states (Bundesländer) usually have official maps online but I've recently checked if an official map of Baden-Württemberg is available. I found this document (https://rp.baden-wuerttemberg.de/Themen/Verkehr/Strassen/Kartenverzeichnis/Kartenverzeichnis_gesamt.pdf). pdfs are only internally available but you can order a printed version. There are 13 pages a 9 €. That means, the latest map (2014 version) costs 117 €......................

There are more B roads in BaWü like this, e.g. B28 west of A81.

I'll wait till the 2015 manual traffic counting result will be published for BaWü (it's currently only available for 9 out of 16 Bundesländer).

What about B486 to Heidenheim an der Brenz?

It's B466: http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deu.b466
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on September 03, 2017, 06:51:07 am
Where is the B19 from Ulm?

The short segment from A8 Ulm-Ost to B10/B28? It was planned to be rededicated w/o any condition by 2015. I couldn't find any info though. It's still indicated to be 'B19' on GM and OSM.

It has been rededicated to L1079. 'B19' is removed from signs. Km posts indicate L1079.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on December 30, 2017, 04:30:52 pm
I've started a review of deub system. Well, drafting the next level (Landesstraßen deul) was and is already a kind of a review I've started almost a year ago. Nevertheless, I'll do now:

1. Re-sync waypoints of deua*
2. Re-sync waypoints of deub*
3. Check if deub routes should be split
3. Re-sync waypoints of eufsf*
4. Draft new deul system (if not yet done)
5. Concurrencies check / NMP check / Data check

*Including concurrent eure routes

I'll do it state by state and I think it will still take more than one year. I don't plan to draft other new systems meanwhile but will peer-review some systems.

Once this will be done, I could activate deub system if there are no objections?
Or is anyone willing to peer-review deub system (or the subsequent deul systems which would partially include deub)?
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on January 23, 2018, 02:43:18 pm
except B28 and B28a (because it should be rerouted in "Mid 2016" but I couldn't find any reliable info how it should be changed and it's still discussed, no final decision) and a short B32 section which is directly affected by the B28 rededication.

It was finally rededicated.

https://rp.baden-wuerttemberg.de/rpt/Seiten/pressemitteilung.aspx?rid=1073
https://rp.baden-wuerttemberg.de/rpt/PresseAnhang/Karte_Umstufung_Dornstetten_Tuebingen.pdf

The old B28 is now L404, L362, L1362 and B296 between Dornstetten and Tübingen.
The former B28aDor, L370, L355, L355a, B14Hor, B28a, L361 and B28aTub are B28 now. However, it's interrupted by L370 b/n Rottenburg and Tübingen where a new aligned B28 is still u/c till 2020. That means, the western B28 from the French border to Rottenburg is B28 (http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deubw.b028) in HB and the eastern B28 from Tübingen to Ulm will be B28Reu (http://tm.teresco.org/hb/index.php?r=deubw.b028reu) after the next site update.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on January 26, 2018, 01:13:36 pm
I've already completed reviewing deua, eursf, eure and deub in 5 out of 16 states (BB, BE, HB, NI and NW). I'll continue with HH and BY.
I've completed drafting 7 out of 13 Landesstraßen (tier 5) systems (deubbl, deubwl, deubyst, deuhel, deunwl, deurpl, deusl). I'll continue with deunil.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on May 26, 2018, 06:45:12 am
The announced deub review is done now. The final pull request is submitted.

The German truck toll will fall due for all Bundesstraßen as of 1st July 2018. On http://www.mauttabelle.de/ ("toll table") all German routes with truck toll are listed. There already was a list for Autobahns and the few tolled Bundesstraßen but I had not expected that a table like this will be published.
I will check the list to ensure that I have all routes in HB and that I don't have rededicated routes in HB.


I have completed drafting 13 out of 14 tier 5 state highway systems. They are in preview now.
Only Thuringian Landesstraßen (deuthl) is left to be drafted. The Thuringian road authority usually publishes a road map each May but the 2018 is not yet available. I'll start drafting the system once the map is online.

When this will be done, I'll activate deub system. As from then, all deub changes will be noted on the update table and I'll try to avoid breaking any user data (renaming waypoints w/o alt labels etc.).

Feel free to request additional waypoints you need to describe your travels.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: yakra on June 18, 2018, 10:11:45 pm
DEU-SN B6: should AdeStr_E instead be AdeAll_E ?
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on June 18, 2018, 11:33:55 pm
DEU-SN B6: should AdeStr_E instead be AdeAll_E ?

Yep, locally changed for B6 and concurrent B87. The western waypoint @ B2/B6 was already AdeAll_W!?!?!?
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on August 27, 2018, 03:29:41 pm
All German Landesstraßen systems are in preview now :)

I've started checking Bundesstraßen system with toll data from mauttabelle.de. You might have noticed that I broke list files when I've changed routes. More routes have been downgraded than I had expected and I've added some short routes.

There is a file on mauttabelle.de containing all toll routes (Autobahn and Bundesstraße) with waypoints and their coordinates. I could convert it so that I can load all routes into our wpt editor. Many Bundesstraßen have hundreds of lines and the wpt editor struggles with handling this data. In total, all deua + deub routes have more than 140,000 lines.

Nevertheless, B1 to B64 are done, B65 to B999 (huge gap between B588 and B999 though) are still to be checked.
I hope I can complete it by the end of September before the file will be updated - I hope I can make a simple Notepad++ comparsion to figure out the changes...
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: panda80 on August 28, 2018, 03:22:40 am
Maybe it would be nice to have a waypoint on DEU-TH B19 at the intersection with Wartburallee? I guess many people are coming from the motorway A4 to visit the castle (like I did), and then turn back. The distance between the points is quite long there.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub)
Post by: michih on August 28, 2018, 10:00:00 am
Maybe it would be nice to have a waypoint on DEU-TH B19 at the intersection with Wartburallee?

I've added "WarAll". Will be in with my next pull request.

I think that I would also need this point but I don't remember which route we took in pre-Autobahn era back then in 1991... I only remember that we entered TH via B19 (now L3019) and that we drove from Zella-Mehlis to Oberhof. I remember that we talked about the best route but all had disadvantages. And I remember that roads were quite congested that day.
Title: Re: Germany Bundesstraßen (deub) + Landesstraßen (deuxxl)
Post by: michih on October 14, 2018, 08:45:44 am
deub will be active with the next site update.

I'll keep this thread for reporting issues to the 14 Landesstraßen/Staatsstraßen systems (tier 5) in Germany.