Author Topic: France Routes Départementales (frad)  (Read 5682 times)

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Offline michih

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Re: France Routes Départementales (frad)
« Reply #90 on: August 15, 2019, 05:41:57 am »
Same situation for N7 in Essonne. And there seem to be similar cases according to wikisara:

Quote
À noter la renumérotation originale dans les départements des Bouches-du-Rhône (D7n) et du Var (DN7). Ces désignations particulières spécifiques à ces deux départements ont été choisies pour conserver l'appellation RN7, à grande valeur symbolique. L'Essonne (91) a quant à elle choisi de ne pas renuméroter la route nationale déclassée, ce qui est source de confusion quant à son statut réel.
Google translated:
Quote
Note the original renumbering in the departments of Bouches-du-Rhône (D7n) and Var (DN7). These special designations specific to these two departments have been chosen to retain the RN7 designation, which has a high symbolic value. Essonne (91) has chosen not to renumber the declassed national road, which is confusing as to its actual status.
:)

Offline si404

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Re: France Routes Départementales (frad)
« Reply #91 on: August 15, 2019, 06:44:49 am »
It's a total mess, but this is what you get if you number roads by who maintains them (see also the mess the other side of the Alps, and (to a lesser extent) the Pyrenees).

It seems that the IDF departments didn't really want the downgrades, or don't really care about signage. Probably a bit of both.

Add in that N7 is the French route 66 type famous route and downgrading any of it was seen as controversial.

Offline michih

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Re: France Routes Départementales (frad)
« Reply #92 on: August 15, 2019, 10:44:55 am »
I've generally skipped the "numéro d'ordre", for instance, D4E1 is just D4E.

I've changed my mind since there are a lot of routes in Seine-et-Marne (77) with "numéro d'ordre". For instance, there are D32, D32E2, D32E3 and D32E4, or D55, D55B, D55E, D55E1, D55E4 and D55EB, or D137, D137E, D137E2, D137E3 and D137E4.

Offline michih

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Re: Split France into regions
« Reply #93 on: August 18, 2019, 03:58:48 am »
I found two issues about the "split into regions" action.

A16 goes into IDF again, the "border section" should be as follows:

Code: [Select]
N1/N184 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.103123&lon=2.266660
11 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.127109&lon=2.253426
12 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.149742&lon=2.247434
IDF/HDF http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.153396&lon=2.244856
HDF/IDF http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.164654&lon=2.231284
IDF/HDF http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.172038&lon=2.227864
13 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=49.209607&lon=2.156625

A77 is also not 100% correct on leaving IDF. It should be read as follows:

Code: [Select]
A6 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.217153&lon=2.773619
17 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.172554&lon=2.766795
IDF/CVL_1 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.163910&lon=2.760731
CVL/IDF_1 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.162661&lon=2.759199
IDF/CVL_2 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.161155&lon=2.757622
CVL/IDF http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.153733&lon=2.752805
IDF/CVL_3 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.142244&lon=2.741325
+X02 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.127143&lon=2.712765
A19 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.060328&lon=2.671480

@Si, let me know if I should deal with it and find section names.

Offline michih

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Re: France Routes Départementales (frad)
« Reply #94 on: August 18, 2019, 05:40:47 am »
I've completed drafting the first mainland system for the metropolitan region Île-de-France around Paris. It is the smallest but most populated mainland region with 8 departements. fraidfd system has more than 5,500mi with more than 1,200 routes. Paris departement (75) does not have D routes.

wikisara is a good source but there's a lack of overview articles for many departements. I've edited the url manually and found a lot of articles. However, there is usually no full list of routes. I've included everything confirmed by wikisara and OSM/GM. If OSM/GM were incomplete, I've checked GSV.
There's also a map (geoportal for Seine-Saint-Denis which is also fine but sometimes different to OSM/GM. I've only drafted routes according to the map and have ignored what OSM, GM or wikisara indicate.

Main issues are outdated old signs, especially for old N routes, and inaccurate GM and OSM data. GM often indicates the old N route old, OSM and GM often extend D route numbers from a departement into the next departement. That means, the number doesn't change on OSM but there is often no evidence that the route is a D route in the second departement. Or there is a different number but OSM and GM indicate the wrong one.

Routes are often downgraded to "communal" roads. I've usually ignored the fact if the route through the town is clear (confirmed by OSM and GM). I haven't drafted routes which are indicated on wikisara being completely downgraded but indicated on OSM and GM. I have included similar routes if there is no wikisara article for the route though.

In general, I would not rely on OSM in France! We should minimum find another source, e.g. GM. If both are identical, it usually seems to be correct. I press the "OSM" button in wpt editor and report the issue to OSM maintainers when I find incorrect data. I hope it will be fixed one day to avoid having to check routing again and again in the future.


Some notes to routes of "active" systems:

Shouldn't N415 wp "N1" be renamed since there is no N1 route (in HB)?

N441 should be truncated at north end according to wikisara (confirmed by OSM)