Author Topic: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales  (Read 360 times)

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Offline michih

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mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« on: December 23, 2021, 01:25:17 pm »
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Offline michih

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Re: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2022, 03:47:04 pm »
It's the only French system with lower-case suffixes in route names and wp labels. Odd but fine to me.
They are banners though, please change like you did for Reunion.


N1:
A1_W -> D13/D14 because the concurrent A1 ends here
N4 -> N4_S or N4_For

N3:
D46 -> D46_N
D45 -> ToD45 and add matching wp for D45

N5:
A1/D3 -> A1 ? I don't remember how you dealt with it when I recently mentioned it
N6 -> N6_anything e.g. Mar
N8 -> N8_anything e.g. Mar


N8:
D35a_W -> CheCou
D35a_E -> D35a
D8 -> D8/D18
D18 -> D18_E


D1:
PoiHya -> Rey ?
Split N3 into two wps
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.618868&lon=-60.911368 to match D6's wp suggested subsequently


D2:
N1/N4_S -> N1/N4
N4 -> N4_E
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.763759&lon=-60.910081


D3b:
D3 -> D3/D27


D5:
D6_E/W -> D6_N/S ?

D6:
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.619081&lon=-60.898097 because road has a dead-end


D7:
Is also signed on N5 - and indicated on OSM + GM, but not signed at the roundabout (but all other directions) --> it's in HB as D7a right now. Keep as-is or remove the segment?
Add shaping point http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.487983&lon=-60.972048
Replace AveFla by a more major junction, e.g. ToN5_E or ToN5_Luc http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.466121&lon=-60.931766 including matching wp for N5
ToN5 -> ToN5_W or _Tro ?
Add wp for Les Trois-Îlets ?
Add wp for Village de la Poterie ?


D8:
N8 is off, also concurrent D18
D18 -> D18_S


D8a:
D7/D7a --> D7 ? That's how I deal with it in mainland France, especially because there are many 3- or 4-digits routes with suffixed routes intersecting at the same junction


D9:
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.469656&lon=-60.856903, also matching wp on N5

Offline michih

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Re: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« Reply #2 on: July 05, 2022, 02:26:07 pm »
D10:
End -> AnseCou?


D10Gra:
End -> FondMou ?
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.867426&lon=-61.127769


D12:
Does it really exist between D11 and D1?
OSM does not indicate a road, and the GM road is not visible on satellite view on the only section not covered by the forest. GM does also not indicate D12 for the whole route but only on the southern-most segment ending at the same location like OSM has the end. Neither wikisara nor wikipedia help.
N3_N/_S -> _W/_E?

D13:
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.616875&lon=-61.048590 (secondary highway)


D15:
N4_N is off
N4_N/S -> N4_E/W?


D16:
N6 -> N6_E


D18a:
N8 wp: I cannot read the 2021 GSV signs towards Rue des Anti-Esclavagistes and what's indicated as "D18a" on OSM but I assume that both one-way streets are N8. Thus, I'd put the N18a wp in-between e.g. http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.486204&lon=-60.901991, also for concurrent D18


D19:
D20_W/E -> N/S?


D20a:
GM + OSM suggest that the route ends at the hospital


D22b:
Does it extend south of D22 as OSM+GM suggest?


D24:
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.774343&lon=-61.003650 because there must be anything "relevant" (or banana?) when there's a rail station, Musée De La Banane?


D25:
Add wp or shaping point between N4 and D3 to make clear that the southern route is the right one


D26:
D3_S/N -> N/S


D33:
Cha is indicated as "cap-ferre, Sainte-Anne" on GM


D34:
Should ToD5 be moved to http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.530810&lon=-60.897791 as suggested by GM?


D35a:
CheFonMas_W -> CheFondMas_W

D38:
There is no sign on 2021 GSV at the roundabout where OSM has the end. Truncate?
Add another wp between the roundabout and D7, likely for Rue des Mangles


D39:
End -> MonPel or SenMonPel?


D40:
D13/D13a -> D13?


D40b:
Not indicated on OSM, GM nor signed


D41:
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.613062&lon=-61.070501
A4 -> A1
D52 -> D52_S


D45:
CasDid -> FonDid? It's not directly at the water fall and there are two water falls


D45a:
Is only indicated on GM and no GSV available. Not sure if we should have it in HB if there is no other source


D46:
Move RueMon to Rue Montesquieu to match D51's wp. Also add matching wp for N3. OR: Rename RueMon to RuePieSem and move D51's wp
N3 -> N3_N


D48:
Add http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=14.623347&lon=-61.051481 (secondary highway, see D13)


D50:
Not indicated on OSM, GM nor signed


D52:
Does it really extend south of D41 as suggested by OSM only?


D53:
Nothing on OSM, GM nor GSV. Does it exist?


D54:
OSM only indicates it south of D43, GM does not indicate it at all, no sign at south end. Does it exist?


D56:
Only indicated on GM but with loop. OSM does not show it at all and there seems to be no sign


D59:
OSM and GM have the route on the same streets but our route is different (even starts at different junctions) and I think that it needs to be changed.


D60:
Not on GM but signed. Fine.


D61:
Only indicated on OSM. Not signed. Remove?


D63:
Does it really extend beyond Ver as only suggested by OSM?
Add a shaping point between N2 and Ver in case you truncate the route because it would exceed the limits

Offline michih

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Re: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2022, 02:18:48 pm »
I had a quick final look into it and wonder about:

D45a:
Is only indicated on GM and no GSV available. Not sure if we should have it in HB if there is no other source

Fine if GM indication is enough evidence.

D50:
Not indicated on OSM, GM nor signed

Found it on GM with deep zoom-in. Fine if D45a is also fine.

D53:
Nothing on OSM, GM nor GSV. Does it exist?

I checked OSM, GM and GSV again. What's the evidence? There must be any criteria since you also removed D40b.

D54:
OSM only indicates it south of D43, GM does not indicate it at all, no sign at south end. Does it exist?

Ok, I found "D54" on Avenue Émile Maurice (OSM) but nothing on Rue d'Anglebernes in-between. Fine if OSM is enough evidence.


Datacheck errors and NMPs are FPs.

Offline si404

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Re: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2022, 03:02:02 pm »
What's the evidence? There must be any criteria since you also removed D40b.
Sorry, yes, WikiSara is my source for all these 'does the route exist or not'.

Offline michih

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Re: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2022, 03:14:30 pm »
What's the evidence? There must be any criteria since you also removed D40b.
Sorry, yes, WikiSara is my source for all these 'does the route exist or not'.

I deeply trusted in wikisara when drafting the FRA-IDF D routes but I changed my mind meanwhile and usually don't look into it anymore. wikisara is often outdated and the indicated routing on the map is very often plain wrong compared to GSV.

In general*, OSM is usually confirmed by GSV but OSM is also sometimes totally outdated in some departements. My rule of thumb is: If OSM + GM show the same, trust them! If OSM + GM differ, check on GSV. If GSV confirms OSM, go with it. If GSV does not confirm OSM, check GSV date and OSM object change history.

* for mainland France but also other European regions, dunno if we can apply it to MTQ and rest of world

Offline michih

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Re: mtqd: Martinique Routes Départementales
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2022, 03:47:29 pm »
D53's wikisara article got a major update in March 2020. That's "quite recent". However, OSM was also frequently updated (last time March / May 2021) and never had D53..... hmm.....