NJ/NY: Point Concerns since 8/5-8/7/2022 Trip

[cockroachking]

Regarding I-81, current 4 is definitely 4A, and current 4A is definitely 4B, though I don't see a way to get the correct labels in place without breaking .list files. Since I-86Bin and NY17Bin only use I-81's number, their 4(81) points could be properly changed to 4A(81) without any adverse effects.

Regarding the Exit 72 and friends situation with NY17Bin and I-86FutBin, current 72B should be 72 and current 72 should be 72B, though again I don't see a way to implement the correct labels without issue.

Regarding NY419, it is signed east-west, but the reference marker order in NYSDOT GIS support the orientation in the HB, so I guess it could go either way.

Also, NY17Bin (& I-86FutBin) and NY17C are just barely missing a graph connection at Exit 69.

Some additional fixes for routes mentioned:

NY13:
MilHillRd > CR134
WarRd > CR121
Route out of tolerance between WarRd and NY366_W

NY79:
BlaOakRd > CR136
SheRd > CR172
BesRd > CR175

NY96:
KruCorRd > CR141
NewDepRd > CR130 (also affects NY34)
MapAve > CR188 (also affects NY34)
MicHolRd > CR1 (also affects NY34)

[rickmastfan67]

yakra, might want to finally deal with this thread before it balloons even more. LOL!

[Markkos1992]

NY 25:  Consider adding a point at 6th St (signed access to NY 114 SB).  Also FroSt>-MainSt_S.

[Markkos1992]

NY 454: Should a point be added at Broadway Ave? 

[Markkos1992]

Belt Pkwy:  Should there be a 7A added at Shell Rd?  It looks like Exit 7 goes beyond 1PPI.

NY 25:  Consider adding a point at Glen Cove Rd (suggest the same for NY 25B).

NY 27A:  SWelAve>-WelAve

NY 109: 
1. I think this route should be flipped.
2.  Consider adding a point at CR 3. (direct connection to Southern State Pkwy and NY 27)

[cockroachking]

Belt Pkwy:  Should there be a 7A added at Shell Rd?  It looks like Exit 7 goes beyond 1PPI.

I would say so. Also, point 7 should probably be changed to 7B for consistency.

Also, shaping point +X05 (just west of the Mill Basin Bridge) is significantly off-center, since it appears that it is located on the old Belt Pkwy centerline before the old Mill Basin Bridge was replaced by the current one (can be seen on Historic Aerials). Not sure if that realignment is worthy of an updates entry or not.

[cockroachking]

Since this is turning into a catch-all NY thread, here's some stuff from routes that I traveled on during my trip the other day.

NY28:
13thLakeRd > CR78
CedRivRd > CR12
Missing interchange at CR72
The point at NY212 needs to be recentered since this intersection was realigned when the new bridge over the Esopus Creek was built. (Same spot September 2023 vs July 2018)

NY30:
CedRivRd > CR12 (see NY28)
BigBroRd > CR4_Ham
CR4 > CR4_Sch
AlgDr > CR5
BenRd > CR6
NewRd > CR56
FayRd > CR41_Fra
CR41 > CR41_Del

NY32:
CR38 > CR36
PetRd > CR2
Requesting a point at CR108 (in Albany County) to accurately map my travels. I used CR108 to get from NY32 to NY396.

NY212:
Recenter point at NY28 (see NY28)

NY300:
I-87 > *I-87 since both ramps that used to connect to NY300 here are closed (c. 2009-10)

NY443:
CR252 > ThaParkRd (to match the corresponding point on NY157A) or ToNY157A (since it is not signed as Thatcher Park Rd). Either way, it is unsigned reference route NY910J and not a county route, so the point label should be changed.

[Markkos1992]

US 1/US 9: SStiSt>-StiSt (nonessential prefix)

US 9: 
1.  I think CR547_N is a no-build, but yeah, if its routing is what I think it is, makes no sense if it is going to be signed on US 9.
2. I do not see Morganville Rd at MorRd.... (EDIT:  I only saw it on those signs NE2 mentioned on US 9 NB.)
3. Should there be a point added at Throckmorton Lane / Ticetown Road south of CR 516?2.
4. Should there be a point added here north of NJ 34?

NJ 36:
1.  I would probably rename OceAve_N for the Sandy Hook Recreation Area (or whatever it is actually called).
2. NavAve_W>-NavAve?
3.  GSV wants ValDr to be ValRd....

[neroute2]

US 1/US 9: SStiSt>-StiSt (nonessential prefix)

US 9: 
1. I do not see Morganville Rd at MorRd....
2. Should there be a point added at Throckmorton Lane / Ticetown Road south of CR 516?2.
3. Should there be a point added here north of NJ 34?

Assuming this is where MorRd is (I'm on my phone and can't check easily):
https://maps.app.goo.gl/o5UjfFJRXJN6TJhy8
TenRd may be better anyway as it's a longer lasting name. Or CR3 (which is signed, just not on US 9).

Yes for the interchanges.

[Markkos1992]

Onto NY and CT from last weekend's trip:

NY 52:  (east to west)
1.  OldRte52>-OldNY52
2.  A point should be added at CR 27. (direct connection to I-84)
3.  FisHooRd>-HookRd
4.  SMonSt>-WalSt (to avoid prefix/suffix debate)
5.  LakShoDr>-LakeShoDr
6.  Consider replacing the shaping point west of LakShoDr with a visible point?
7.  I am unsure we have a road at OldMouRd.
8.  Should we have split the difference at US 209 in Ellenville?  I remember seeing the green 52 markers on both Center St and Canal St.  It gives me second thoughts about how this was addressed in 2019.
9.  Consider replacing the shaping point west of HacRd with a visible point.
10. Consider replacing the shaping point east of CR105 with a visible point.
11.  WadRd>-WadeRd
12.  WesSt>-WestSt
13.  CorRd should be slightly relocated.
14.  CR199>-CR149
15. BufRd>-BuffRd

NY 52 BUS (Beacon):  (east to west)
1.  RedSchRd>-CR36
2.  TelRd>-TelAve

NY 117:
1. There should be a point west of NY 448 for the entrance to Rockefeller State Park.
2.  Consider adding a point at Grant St.
3.  SGreRd>-GreAve
4.  Consider replacing the shaping point north of NY120_N with a visible point. (Roaring Brook Rd seems to be the best spot.)
5.  Consider adding a point at Preston Way.  (signed access to Saw Mill River Pkwy)
6.  Consider adding a point at Green Ln.  (signed access to Saw Mill River Pkwy)

NY 120:  Consider replacing shaping points with visible points.

NY 120A: (north to south)
1.  GatLn>-KingSt_N
2.  Consider making BedRd visible and possibly eliminate the nearby shaping points.
3.  Consider replacing NedLn with nearby GleSt (Glenville St).
4.  I would change KingSt to WilAve.
5.  PeaSt>-PeaSt_S

NY 141:  Consider adding a point in Hawthorne where the road turns at Elwood Ave.

NY 448:  It looks like the shaping point southwest of NY 117 should be visible at the turn at Lake Rd.

US 7: 
1.  The line north of I-95 briefly makes it west of US 1.
2.  GriMillRd>-GriMillRd_W. 
3.  MainAve>-MainAve_S.

[cockroachking]

NY 52:
7.  I am unsure we have a road at OldMouRd.

Looks like a trailhead/parking lot to me. Annoyingly, it appears to be in use though. If it wasn't, I would recommend moving it to nearby Cragsmoor Rd, an unsigned county route that connects to the hamlet of Cragsmoor.

8.  Should we have split the difference at US 209 in Ellenville?  I remember seeing the green 52 markers on both Center St and Canal St.  It gives me second thoughts about how this was addressed in 2019.

This reference marker means that Canal St is the half of a couplet in the opposite direction of the inventory direction, hence the V in the bottom line. (See the bottom of this page, which is sourced from NYSDOT's Reference Marker Manual.) This makes sense given that NYSDOT GIS only shows NY52 on Center St, since their shapefiles only show the inventory direction of couplets. This converges with common NYSDOT practice for couplets, of which a nearby example would be US44/NY55 in Poughkeepsie.

Editing to add: I also found a NYSDOT-owned signal on Canal St at Market St and Liberty St. The sticker with the (recently phased out) NYSDOT logo says U-70, which makes sense since it is in Ulster County. (This is typical Region 8 practice for inventorying signals.) I would definitely conclude that NY52 officially follows both Center and Canal; the real question is if it should be treated as an average couplet (split the difference) or if there should be two separate routes since Center and Canal are both two-way streets.

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Also, the "northern" intersection of NY17B and NY52 (point NY17B_W on NY52) appears to located under the impression that New Turnpike B Rd is the third leg of a wye. However, I would make the case that it is not, since it is a 1 lane town road, and also based on this sign (still there as of October '23) at the intersection of NY17B and NY52.