Travel Mapping
User Discussions => Other Discussion => Topic started by: SSOWorld on February 16, 2025, 08:33:22 am
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Is it possible to select different colors for the systems that are not numbered highways (like we do with usasf, usaif, usausb, usaib, etc. for USA? Here, the ones suggested to be a different color would be:
usanp (national park routes - say a green hue)
usaush (historic routes)
usatr (Tourist routes - yes I know it's disabled)
Right now, they're all brown, which mishmashes them with the state route system, which makes for a complete cluster of brown lines that aren't so sensible.
This can be applied, if not already, to other systems elsewhere too.
GitHub issue https://github.com/TravelMapping/Web/issues/813
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Adding and changing default colors is not hard, but getting some consensus about those changes might be. I'd be happy to put code on the tmtest or tmdevel versions of the site so people could take a look at some proposed changes without the messy URLs needed to specify color overrides.
I would definitely support usanp and usaush and eventually usatr having colors distinct from what we use for US state highway systems.
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Is it possible to select different colors for the systems that are not numbered highways (like we do with usasf, usaif, usausb, usaib, etc. for USA?
Do you want users to be able to change them back and forth in the frontend, or do you simply want different colors per default?
The latter can be done without coding. We'd just had to agree on colors and change them in systems.csv (https://github.com/TravelMapping/HighwayData/blob/master/systems.csv#L311).
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If someone [i[wants[/i] the option to it can be considered, but as you hinted, it's extra work and I don't have a preference either way. However, I feel the defaults should be changed.
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As the person who selected brown for all these, I agree.
However it's the state highway systems that should be changing colours as these routes are mostly signed with brown shields and brown signs. Globally, brown is the colour of tourist signs and the US is no different.
When I first suggested it, however, others didn't want to change the state highway colour, despite brown just being a random colour for them.
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Oh I can see this becoming a mess 💩
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Oh I can see this becoming a mess 💩
Be careful what you wish for. You just might get it. ;D :o
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A quick switch up on the tmtest.teresco.org server: replace all USA state highway systems with a bit darker version of TMgreen, and swith usaib to TMlightsalmon.
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I certainly like that shade of green better than TMgreen and wouldn't mind seeing usaib and the E routes switch to that, though I'm not sure about that color scheme overall. The thing with lightsalmon is that it's not exactly easy to see, which is the hard thing with replacing brown for the state route color; it's hard to find something that's both easy to see and isn't obnoxious. Clinched lightsalmon and unclinched red look particularly close, which is particlarly notable if you look at my map of NJ rendered as if it was not in North America (https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?u=vdeane&rg=NJ&colors=usanj:lightsalmon:lightsalmon).
(this is where I wish we had spoiler tags, but here's the hint if you didn't notice it: I've clinched NJ 55, but who can tell with those colors?)
The easiest way to sidestep this would be to do usanp, usanyp, usaush, and usatr as that darker green even though it would be inconsistent with the rest of the world. Parks and scenic byways are already often colored such on maps, so it's not a stretch for them, though it would be weird for usaush.
Is there a list of already defined colors available somewhere so we can experiment? I could have sworn there was but I don't remember where.
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The easiest way to sidestep this would be to do usanp, usanyp, usaush, and usatr as that darker green even though it would be inconsistent with the rest of the world.
It's not so much inconsistency with other countries that's my issue with dark green for US tourist routes, but the inconsistency with the real world.
I like the dark green, and - while I think it works for state highways perfectly fine (the problem with the TMTest colour scheme is usaib), I'd be OK with it on tourist routes if I lose the 'battle for the brown'. Especially if it is common mapping to show stuff with green.
Light Salmon was meant to be a lighter alternative to red, which is rather bright and so not great for dense systems (see here (https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=si404&rg=WLS&colors=gbna:red:red)) - it doesn't go with red well because it's just a toned down version of it.
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The thing with lightsalmon is that it's not exactly easy to see
I agree, I just picked it as a placeholder so it wasn't the same color as the state routes.
Is there a list of already defined colors available somewhere so we can experiment? I could have sworn there was but I don't remember where.
Starting here: https://github.com/TravelMapping/Web/blob/684294e851d41e915709e689e0f64b4640ea4f12/lib/tmjsfuncs.js#L113
Actually, I would like to keep usaib for the same reason as wanting to keep the parks/historic as brown: that's what color they are. But with state highways being so prominent on maps, I also want a color that's not too obnoxious. I feel like a purple or orange would be.
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Is there a list of already defined colors available somewhere so we can experiment? I could have sworn there was but I don't remember where.
Starting here: https://github.com/TravelMapping/Web/blob/684294e851d41e915709e689e0f64b4640ea4f12/lib/tmjsfuncs.js#L113
You can play with the url:
I think the unhighlighted salmon color is too light
That's the current color: https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?rg=jpn&colors=jpnh:rgb(224,162,162):rgb(240,150,115) (https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?rg=jpn&colors=jpnh:rgb(224,162,162):rgb(240,150,115))
Feel free to change the rgb settings by editing the url (first = unclinched, second = clinched). Once you have good settings, you can suggest it for discussion here.
Actually, I would like to keep usaib for the same reason as wanting to keep the parks/historic as brown: that's what color they are. But with state highways being so prominent on maps, I also want a color that's not too obnoxious. I feel like a purple or orange would be.
We use TMyellow in Europe.
I think that Europe is quite good with: Tier 1: TMblue (freeways) - Tier 2: TMteal (expressways/express roads) - Tier 3: TMgreen (international E roads) - Tier 4: TMlightsalmon (national roads) - Tier 5: TMyellow (state roads)/TMbrown (tourist routes)
If I got it right, North America is: Tier 1: TMblue - Tier 2: TMgreen/TMred - Tier 3: TMteal/TMmagenta - Tier 4: TMbrown - Tier 5: TMyellow
Maybe the mixed tier 2 + tier 3 systems cause the issue?
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I did some experimenting. I think I found a purple that isn't too bad. The PA links also use standard CSS green, since I wanted to see what a darker one would look like. PA and NJ both have usanp in them; PA tests what it looks like with a lot of dense lines, and NJ with a mix of many clinched and many not. The ON links are to compare to the color for secondary routes.
Gray (not TMGray):
https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=PA&colors=usaib:green:green;usapa:rgb(130,130,130):rgb(125,125,125)
https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=NJ&colors=usanj:rgb(130,130,130):rgb(125,125,125)
https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=ON&colors=canon:rgb(130,130,130):rgb(125,125,125)
Purple:
https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=PA&colors=usaib:green:green;usapa:rgb(170,100,150):rgb(170,100,150)
https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=NJ&colors=usanj:rgb(170,100,150):rgb(170,100,150)
https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=ON&colors=canon:rgb(170,100,150):rgb(170,100,150)
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I like that purple color. It isn't too bright and contrasts with map background tiles better than the green.
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I like that purple color. It isn't too bright and contrasts with map background tiles better than the green.
I do like the green you were testing better than the really bright one that's used for usaib now; maybe that could shift too?
For a while it felt like both the purple and the gray were less visible than the current brown, but loading one of my links cold, I think most of that is just my eyes being trained to look for brown and not being used to the other colors (which would explain why it seemed like every possible color was like that). We've had the current colors for so long (and everything except tier 3 in North America has been the same even longer thanks to CHM) that any change is going to be a lot to get used to.
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I've updated tmtest to use vdeane's suggested purple color for US state highway systems, switching usaib back to TMgreen. I think it looks good!
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I've updated tmtest to use vdeane's suggested purple color for US state highway systems, switching usaib back to TMgreen. I think it looks good!
Nice. I think I figured out why it was harder to see - needed some tweaking of the unclinched color. I think I managed to achieve a similar balance to TM brown (I even literally compared the testing RI to regular RI and kept adjusting until it looked like it was only a different color, not darker).
https://tmtest.teresco.org/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=RI&colors=usari:rgb(200,130,180):rgb(170,100,150)
https://tmtest.teresco.org/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=PA&colors=usapa:rgb(200,130,180):rgb(170,100,150)
I imagine that we'll want to change Canada as well? tmtest only has the change on US regions right now.
Actually, there might even be cause to go one step darker on the clinched:
https://tmtest.teresco.org/user/mapview.php?units=miles&u=vdeane&rg=RI&colors=usari:rgb(200,130,180):rgb(160,90,140)
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Thanks, I think those are nice improvement. I updated tmtest to use the "one step darker" version of TMpurple.
Let's see what some others think about the potential change, both in the color codes used for TMpurple and TMgreen and the use of the new TMpurple for state systems in the US. I agree we'd probably make a similar change for Canada provincial routes.
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Looks fine to me!
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The darker TMgreen is fine to me. It seems that you only updated the system color but not the "concurrencies color". Is that on purpose?
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The darker TMgreen is fine to me. It seems that you only updated the system color but not the "concurrencies color". Is that on purpose?
Didn't even think about that one. I'm happy to make changes there too if that's of interest.
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The darker TMgreen is fine to me. It seems that you only updated the system color but not the "concurrencies color". Is that on purpose?
Didn't even think about that one. I'm happy to make changes there too if that's of interest.
I've just seen that we have two green tones:
colorCodes[5] = { name: "TMgreen", unclinched: "rgb(100,200,100)", clinched: "rgb(0,224,0)" };
colorCodes[9] = { name: "TMdarkgreen", unclinched: "rgb(61,94,77)", clinched: "rgb(24,132,70)" };
TMdarkgreen is currently not used in systems.csv. If you'd simple apply your tmtest settings for TMdarkgreen, we could change the systems.csv entries for those systems we want to change it.
37 systems do currently have TMgreen. I don't think that we need to change anything outside of the US.
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The darker TMgreen is fine to me. It seems that you only updated the system color but not the "concurrencies color". Is that on purpose?
Didn't even think about that one. I'm happy to make changes there too if that's of interest.
I've just seen that we have two green tones:
colorCodes[5] = { name: "TMgreen", unclinched: "rgb(100,200,100)", clinched: "rgb(0,224,0)" };
colorCodes[9] = { name: "TMdarkgreen", unclinched: "rgb(61,94,77)", clinched: "rgb(24,132,70)" };
TMdarkgreen is currently not used in systems.csv. If you'd simple apply your tmtest settings for TMdarkgreen, we could change the systems.csv entries for those systems we want to change it.
37 systems do currently have TMgreen. I don't think that we need to change anything outside of the US.
I would suggest changing primary provincial/territorial routes in Canada to stay consistent with USA. Secondaries of both countries are yellow. Though having not looked at Europe too much because of the density of road documentation there - I'm sure there are differences by region.
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If we decide on something standard, I can change Central/South America and parts of Southeast Asia to match.
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The darker TMgreen is fine to me. It seems that you only updated the system color but not the "concurrencies color". Is that on purpose?
Didn't even think about that one. I'm happy to make changes there too if that's of interest.
I've just seen that we have two green tones:
colorCodes[5] = { name: "TMgreen", unclinched: "rgb(100,200,100)", clinched: "rgb(0,224,0)" };
colorCodes[9] = { name: "TMdarkgreen", unclinched: "rgb(61,94,77)", clinched: "rgb(24,132,70)" };
TMdarkgreen is currently not used in systems.csv. If you'd simple apply your tmtest settings for TMdarkgreen, we could change the systems.csv entries for those systems we want to change it.
37 systems do currently have TMgreen. I don't think that we need to change anything outside of the US.
I mean, eure and other systems (I believe there are a couple of countries in South America that use green as well) IMO would look nicer with the newer green; something about the current green seems overly bright compared to the other colors. Plus it looks closer to the route colors in the real world.
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I think that Europe is fine as it is. Dark green is too close to blue/teal what is tier 1/2.
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I think that Europe is fine as it is. Dark green is too close to blue/teal what is tier 1/2.
Personally, I think the new green is easier to see than the bright green in use on the main site now. It's contrast with blue is fine, and while it is closer to teal, I can still easily tell them apart.
Since the new green is on tmtest even for Europe, feel free to check it out. Italy and Russia struck me as particularly good regions to check (Russia especially as the Europe select freeways don't seem to be much more common than the American ones, so it's hard to find instances where they go near each other elsewhere).
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It will take a bit of getting used to the new colors if they are adopted, but being able to visually separate state routes from the usaush and the other tier 4 routes makes sense.
Curious why you didn't use the same purple that is used on the TM Railways for tier 1 ( i.e. Amtrak). Is that purple too dark when considering the higher density of state routes in any given region?
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It will take a bit of getting used to the new colors if they are adopted, but being able to visually separate state routes from the usaush and the other tier 4 routes makes sense.
Curious why you didn't use the same purple that is used on the TM Railways for tier 1 ( i.e. Amtrak). Is that purple too dark when considering the higher density of state routes in any given region?
From trying it out (https://travelmapping.net/user/mapview.php?u=vdeane&rg=PA&colors=usapa:rgb(128,0,128):rgb(150,28,220)), I would say possibly (although that might be fixable by adjusting the unclinched color), but also because it's so close to the color used for alternate/business/truck US routes. It's also the color used for Easter eggs (which I think Amtrak started as on tmrail, so it might have just stuck there).
The new colors will definitely take getting used to, agreed, but at least I can say that the more I stare at the way they currently display on tmtest, the more I like it, which is more than I can say for previous color change proposals.