usafl: Florida State Highways

[yakra]

FL FL417
49 <-> 49A
Length: 0.22 mi

[rickmastfan67]

FL FL417
49 <-> 49A
Length: 0.22 mi

I could merge that into one point (I think I did it this way because of CR-427), but then I might have to do the same to 50A-50-50B right above it.  That one (50) is a pretty confusing setup of ramps.

[rickmastfan67]

NE2, I'll try to start looking over your newer posts this weekend when I have the time.

[yakra]

I ran a search for labels with a potential city suffix not preceded by an underscore.
FL/usafl/fl.fl012.wpt: CR270Gad http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=30.588053&lon=-84.487052
FL/usafl/fl.fl016.wpt: CR225Cla http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=29.981105&lon=-82.013294
FL/usaus/fl.us098.wpt: CR30Bay +FL30_E http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=30.264852&lon=-85.975040
FL/usaus/fl.us441.wpt: CR44LegA http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=28.832273&lon=-81.818640
FL/usaus/fl.us441.wpt: NW59Ter http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=29.764177&lon=-82.407779[/size]
That last one happened to get caught up in the net. Should have the directional prefix removed. I'm agnostic about cardinal vs ordinal numbering; sometimes it's best to use the one and sometimes it's best to use the other.

[neroute2]

I ran a search for labels with a potential city suffix not preceded by an underscore.
FL/usafl/fl.fl012.wpt: CR270Gad http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=30.588053&lon=-84.487052
FL/usafl/fl.fl016.wpt: CR225Cla http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=29.981105&lon=-82.013294
FL/usaus/fl.us098.wpt: CR30Bay +FL30_E http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=30.264852&lon=-85.975040
FL/usaus/fl.us441.wpt: CR44LegA http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=28.832273&lon=-81.818640
FL/usaus/fl.us441.wpt: NW59Ter http:[/b] //www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=29.764177&lon=-82.407779[/size]
That last one happened to get caught up in the net. Should have the directional prefix removed. I'm agnostic about cardinal vs ordinal numbering; sometimes it's best to use the one and sometimes it's best to use the other.

But if it's a separate segment of the route, it shouldn't get an underscore.
"Distinguish two different same-bannered same-numbered routes as needed with the 3-letter city abbreviations. Also use the city abbreviation for bannerless same-designation spurs or branches, such as the Zurich A3 spur intersecting the main A3."
I'm not sure about 30, 225, and 270, but 44 Leg A definitely fits this.

[yakra]

Hence I left out these entries:
FL/usaus/fl.us027.wpt:FL17Seb_S http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=27.471334&lon=-81.442852
FL/usaus/fl.us098.wpt:FL17Seb_S http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=27.471334&lon=-81.442852
FL/usaus/fl.us301.wpt:FL70Bra +FL70_N http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=27.475339&lon=-82.546616
FL/usaus/fl.us092.wpt:FL574Pla http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=28.016307&lon=-82.135318
(Wait, I should have included that one after all... Is that a county route now?)

If that were all there were to the story, we wouldn't need & have the additional instruction to

2. Choose 3-letter suffixes for a nearby towns if they are fairly close. The 3-letter suffix should be the first 3 letters of the town name. Add a suffix with an underscore and those 3 letters.

The crux of the instruction you quoted, as I see it, lies in how it says "with the 3-letter city abbreviations" -- implying that on already exists, and is known. This would mean the city abbrev as included in a system's CSV file -- common CHM terminology, eh? Not how the US40Bus examples included would by definition have city and abbrev entries attached to the route definition, as contained in the CSV.

[rickmastfan67]

20: LocTerRd should either be renamed AlaTerRd or moved west to the more important SiteC6Rd.
20: US331 needs moving.
20: AspPlaRd is a private dirt road with gates. There's no need for a point there.
20: CR267 -> CR2224

SiteC6Rd added.
US331 location updated.  Also cleaned up a good chunk of US-331 locations due to it's twinning in the area.
AspPlaRd removed. Point @ Enfiger Road (what OSM calls it, as no streetblades visable in StreetView) just to the East added in it's place.
CR2224 corrected.

23: 32 should move south to the overpass
23: 35 should move north, replacing 35A

32: changed.
35/35A: split interchange with a gap of over 1.3 miles between the two sets of ramps with the same number.  This will stay as is.

29: JanSceDr -> CR837_W, CR837 -> CR837_E
29: WhiRd -> MarFieRd (the former isn't signed at 29)

All changed, however, you can kinda see the WhiRd streetblade going SB on FL-29 @ it's next intersection with is pretty close to the one on FL-29.

30: BeaSchRd -> ClaAve
30apor: FL30 -> US98
30e: SeaDr should be moved north to the cul-de-sac and renamed StJosPenSP

30: Fixed.
30a: Fixed.
30e: Kept the 'SeaDr' point since it's the last intersection before the park, and added the 'StJosPenSP' one.

31: CR763_S -> CR763, CR763_N -> NHogBayExt (or move just north to CR760)
35: 92ndPlaRd -> 92ndPlRd (it's a double suffix)

31: Fixed, and went the 'CR760' route.
35: 92ndPlaRd -> 92ndLp

37: FourConMineRd -> FourCorMineRd
37: MainSt -> MainAve, MainSt_Lak -> MainSt
37: OldFL37 -> OldHwy37
37: the actual north end is at MainSt_Lak; beyond there is unsigned SR 35. The only sign I know of that says otherwise is on a side street north of where we end it.

1) fixed
2) fixed
3) fixed
4) GIS agrees.  However, there is indeed a 'SB FL-37 shield' right after the intersection with US-98 which complicates stuff.  Because of that shield, I'm tempted to leave it as-is, unless you know of that shield being removed sometime this year.

=====

All these changes have been made in my local files.

[rickmastfan67]

40: CR328 needs to be moved west
40a doesn't exist anymore and was probably never signed

CR328 fixed (was from before they twinned that area).
Honestly had thought I had deleted the 'FL-40A' file from the TM database.  It's currently unprocessed at least, so, next update I'll nuke it completely.

44: HerBlvd -> BueVisBlvd
44: the US 441 "overlap" is all signed with to plates
44: CR44 -> CR44_E
44: BlueLakeDr -> BlueLakeAve

1) Already done before as a separate post.
2) Already done before as a separate post.
3) No change needed do to route spit.
4) Already done before as a separate post.

45: SocSt -> ScoSt (but why here? why not 7thAve?)
45: FolAve -> FloAve (but why here? why not ColDr?)

1) Fixed.  People coming from I-275 ramps just to the West.
2) Fixed.  Connection to the parallel I-275 which has ramps at this road (Exit #46A).

46: recenter FL453
46: CR15 -> US17/92_N, US17/92_N -> FrenchAve_N

1) Did it that way originally because of how FL-453 loops there and the ramp configuration to get onto it from EB FL-46.  Tweaked it a tic, but that's the best it's gonna get, as it's a different beast compared to how the northern end of FL-23 is.
2) Already done when I did the US-17/92 reroute.

47: WatRd -> WatSt

Fixed.

49: is only signed as US 129, so shouldn't be in CHM

Honestly had thought I had deleted the 'FL-49' file from the TM database.  It's currently unprocessed at least, so, next update I'll nuke it completely.

=====

Changes all made in my local files.

[neroute2]

AspPlaRd removed. Point @ Enfiger Road (what OSM calls it, as no streetblades visable in StreetView) just to the East added in it's place.

Good news: there is a sign.

4) GIS agrees.  However, there is indeed a 'SB FL-37 shield' right after the intersection with US-98 which complicates stuff.  Because of that shield, I'm tempted to leave it as-is, unless you know of that shield being removed sometime this year.

I was unaware of that sign, which does complicate matters. For sensibility I'd also leave it as-is.

[rickmastfan67]

50: CR587 is a more major road than CR493. Recommend adding the former and possibly deleting the latter.
50: KetRd -> CroRitRd, the more important road at the intersection?
50: DeerIslRd should be moved east and renamed OakAve, the more important road there (renamed from Old SR 50).

1) Done.
2) Done. Tweaked in US-98's file as well.
3) Done.

51: I can't verify the CanRd name on signs or GIS. GIS labels LongTreRd as Turkey Road.
52: ShaRidRd should move west to ColRd, a more important road.
52: StaDr is a private driveway. Move just east to OldSanAnnRd?
14: add HarGreDr south of Madison to match the point on 53?

51: I'm guessing the 'CanRd' name on the maps is based off of 'this sign'. I'm inclined to leave it as-is.  As for the 'LongTreRd' one, based on the '09 StreetView showing a 'small' street-blade for the 'side road', I'm inclined to agree that it's Turkey Road, and not what OSM & Google say it is.  That label is changed.
52: ShaRidBlvd is not going to be moved to ColRd.  Why?  Because ColRd doesn't have a full intersection (RIRO), while ShaRidBlvd does.  As for 'StaDr', it's been moved to 'OldSanAnnRd'.
14: Done.

54: BlaLakeRd -> AstPkwy since Black Lake Road is a loop that returns to 54?
54zep: DorSt -> GeiEstDr?
56: MarBlvd -> ManBlvd
56: extend east to US 301
59: BethPageRd -> BetRd? (it's one word on sign, though it's two at the other end, and two words on property appraiser GIS)

54: Done.
54zep: Meh, done.
56: Fixed and extended (& added into US-301's file).
59: Hmmm.  If it's two words on the property appraiser, 2 @ the CR-259 end, 2 in OSM, I'm led to believe that it's an error on street-blade @ FL-59.  So, I'd say just leave this one as-is.

60: move BayDr east to the overpass
60: why HowAve and not ArmAve?
60: FL45 -> FL45_N (it's unsigned to the south)
60: MainSt_BarE -> FlaDr
60: 91MileRd -> 91MineRd
60: LakeWalRd -> WLakeWalRd (it goes to West Lake Wales)
60: CenAve needs to move east
60: interchange with HesRd in Lake Wales

1) This one can honestly be debatable. The 'ramps' part don't get to the overpass, as looking in StreetView, both are treated as 'normal' roads on either side.  For situations like this, usually we put it at the center point between the ramps, which is where the point is currently.  I think I'll just leave this one as-is for now.
2) To be honest here, it's a pair of one-way roads w/o a route designation that both connect up to I-275 Exit #42.  If it would've had a route designation, I would have just centered it between the two, however, since it doesn't have one, I just chose one of the two.  Leaving as-is.
3) But since it isn't signed 'to the south', means we don't have to add the '_N' part (would be a different story if I was doing the entire FL-45 route & other unsigned FL routes).  So, leaving this as-is.
4) Fixed.  Also renamed MainSt_BarW to just MainSt.
5) Fixed.
6) Fixed.
7) Fixed.
9) This one honestly left me scratching me head.  Honestly looks like a normal road intersection since it's merged into the 7th Street intersection & has different named roads on each side.  What does everybody else think about this one?  Compromise and put a point @ 7th Street instead?

61: CR260 -> CR2204
61: FL371 -> CR1555? (SR 371 is no longer state maintained or signed on SR 61, but there is reassurance after you turn)
62: JohnGriRd -> JohnGillRd, but why is there a point here?

61: All fixed. (Have not touched the FL-371 file yet.)
62: It was there to clear a 'Visible Distance' error and bring it under 10 miles between visible points.  However, I've now moved it to the west to Allapattah Road.

64: move 15thSt east to 14thSt?
64: WMainSt -> MainSt
64: SteRSRd -> SteRobSpec (per street blades)

1) It was there due to the fact that's the road where FL-64 splits into the separate 1-way roads.
2) Fixed.
3) Decided to move it to TerDr instead.

65: NorSt -> NorRd
65: LChipPRd doesn't exist; move just south to WOShuRd (name from property appraiser GIS)?
66: WinCrkRd -> WooCrkTr and move it east
69: CR278 -> BirRd

65: Both done.
66: There was a road there in 2008, however, OSM hasn't caught up yet in this area.  So, since I had some spare time, I quickly added it to OSM so I could add it here.
69: Fixed.

19: NF77 -> NF74? Street sign blades say NFR 77 though.

19: Street blades, Google, both say 77.  Could OSM be in the wrong here?  Doubt FDOT would post the wrong street blade, but you never know.  Leaving as-is for now.

I linked to street view that shows a 74 shield. Do we go by shields or street signs?
The Ocala NF map (last page) also shows 74. Looks like a renumbering.

I would say Street Blades here as they are 10x more visible.  If they ever get updated, then we can revisit.


=======


Changes have been made in my local files, and this and the last 2 posts have been submitted.

https://github.com/TravelMapping/HighwayData/pull/3212

[rickmastfan67]

70: PineLevRd -> PineLevSt
70: move LigRanRd east to PlaLakBlvd?
70: OldFL8 -> OldSR8_N; maybe add OldSR8_S
70: should McCRd be MccRd or McCarRd?
70: FL713 -> FLTpk?

1) Fixed.
2) Done.
3) Both done.
4) McCarRd I guess? Maybe? I'm not fully sure since the streetblade shows it as all one word. lol.  Still changed.
5) Honestly, this one could go either way.  FL713 is more logical since it does have the graph connection, while the FL Turnpike doesn't.  Because of that, I think I'll leave it as-is for now.

On a side note, it seems that fl.fl070bra (the weird separate 'N/S' segment from the mainline) had it's signage removed as of late, sometime between June '18 & November '18.  So, it will be removed from the site.  It's still listed in the GIS data, so, who knows if it will ever come back, but I honestly doubt it.  Labels in both US-301 & FL-64 have been adjusted.
1) Going NB just after US-301: June '18 signed -> November '18 no longer signed
2) Going SB just after US-301: June '18 signed -> November '18 no longer signed
3) Going SB just after 'northern' end @ FL-64: June '18 signed -> November '18 no longer signed
4) Going NB just after 44th Ave E: May '16 signed -> November '18 no longer signed

71: DynDockRd -> OldDynDockRd
71: HarNealLp -> HarNeelLp
71: LewBailRd -> LewBaiRd

1) Swapped to PriRd in-town instead.
2) Fixed.
3) Fixed.

72: BeeRidRdExt -> LorRd ("Fka Bee Ridge Rd Ext")
72: MyaSParkRd -> MyaRivSP
73: FinkBCRd -> FriBCRd

72: Both fixed.
73: Fixed.

77: HoaSeaRd -> HouSeaDr or MarBayDr
77: CryLakeRd -> CryLakeDr
77: JohRd -> JohnEricRd
79: SugDollRd -> SugRd (one word on sign)

77: All fixed.
79: Fixed, also re-centered several points due to twinning in a section.

80: US27_N needs to move
80/US27: OldFL80 -> OldUS27, CorBlvd -> CorBlvd_N, OldUS27 -> CorBlvd_S
80: SemWhiRd -> SemPraWhiRd
80: FolRd -> ForHillBlvd or CreBlvd
80: PreRd -> PikeRd
80: move MilAve west to the underpass? or at least west to line up with the road to the south, since it's a gated private driveway to the north
80: FL5 -> OliAve

1) Fixed.
2) Fixed.
3) Fixed (also in US-98 & US-441).
4) ForHillBlvd (tweaked also in US-98 & US-441).
5) Fixed (also in US-98).
6) Fixed (also in US-98).
7) Already done when fixing FL-5 in both FL-80 & US-98's files.

81: SubStaRd -> SubRd (one word per street sign)
81: CR2_W -> CR2/2A?
82: MicLinkAve -> MicAveLink

81: Both fixed.
82: Fixed.

84: HatRd -> HiaRd

Fixed.

84: I-595(7) -> DavRd? Why is this one I-595(*) but the others aren't?
84: I-595(8X) doesn't exist on the SR 84 C/D roads

I will dedicate a separate post to this in awhile, as some discussion might be warranted.  Nothing has been changed yet with these issues.

85: GRMBondBlvd -> GenBondBlvd
85: NWFLRegAir -> DesFWBAir
85: McWAve -> 77thSpeForWay, needs to be moved south a bit
85: CR85A_W -> CR85A_S, CR85A_E -> CR85A_N? CR 85A is signed north at the 'west' end

1) Fixed.
2) Fixed.
3) Fixed.
4) Wild, but fixed.

87: OlfChoRd -> OLFChoRd? OLF stands for Outlying Field
89: RWitRd -> RWhiRd

87: Tweaked.  Also tweaked the location of this and a few other points due to the newly twinned parts of 87.
89: Fixed.

=====

All these changes have been made in my local files.

[rickmastfan67]

84: I-595(7) -> DavRd? Why is this one I-595(*) but the others aren't?
84: I-595(8X) doesn't exist on the SR 84 C/D roads

I will dedicate a separate post to this in awhile, as some discussion might be warranted.  Nothing has been changed yet with these issues.

Alright, getting to this subject.

So, it seems everything was re-configured in the area after the creation of the file.  Originally, it was clear-cut that FL-84 joined with I-595 in this area.  However, nowadays, it isn't.  Going EB, it still does join the EB C/D lanes for I-595, however, WB it's completely separate from I-595.

So, I'll first answer your questions above NE2 to get them out of the way.
1) Because of the start of the 'multiplex'.
2) Yes & no.  No going EB, but yes going WB (yes, there's a separate ramp to the NB FL Turnpike).


So, what to do here?  When looking at StreetView for the EB direction, you can clearly see I-595 exit numbers along the C/D lanes that have EB FL-84 on them, plus all the pull-thru signage clearly shows both routes on them.  However going WB, it's the exact opposite, where only FL-84 signage is there indicating that FDOT doesn't consider them to be part of I-595 (which makes sense since the lanes don't come back to I-595 WB, unlike the EB side).

So, the two solutions I can see would be as follows:

1) Leave as-is.  However, rename 2 labels:
fl.fl084: I-595(8X) -> FLTpk (this is due to WB FL-84 only being able to access this ramp)
fl.i595: 8X -> 8A +8X (this leaves the current '8' as-is as both the 'express' and mainline ramps to the FL Turnpike each have the same number)

2) Put hidden shaping points in-between every single point between 'I-595(7)' & 'I-595(9C)' in FL-84's file to break the multiplex with I-595, but retain the graph connections (I so wish we could get back having the links show up even with the .000001 offset like on CHM so I could avoid doing it like this) with the FL Turnpike & US-441, as well as both ends of where EB FL-84 joins the EB I-595 C/D lanes.
Also relabel current points as follows:
I-595(7) -> DavRd
I-595(8X) -> FLTpk
& leave the other 'I-595()' points as-is label wise since EB does use the I-595 exit #'ing scheme.

So, I'd appreciate opinions here on this.

[Markkos1992]

I think I am leaning towards option 2 as I want to keep the graph connections though I cannot justify leaving the concurrency with FL 84 WB not joining the I-595 WB C/D Lanes at all.

[yakra]

I think I am leaning towards option 2 as I want to keep the graph connections though I cannot justify leaving the concurrency with FL 84 WB not joining the I-595 WB C/D Lanes at all.

Same.

fl.i595: 8X -> 8A +8X (this leaves the current '8' as-is as both the 'express' and mainline ramps to the FL Turnpike each have the same number)

I also favor this.
As an aside, with the WB->NB ramp that doesn't have a counterpart in the main Exit 8 complex, one could make an (a weak?) argument for a One Point Per (rather unorthodox) Interchange treatment here. Not something I feel especially strong about; 2 points can work too.

Maybe zap Exit 9C on 1PPI grounds?

Put hidden shaping points in-between every single point between 'I-595(7)' & 'I-595(9C)' in FL-84's file to break the multiplex with I-595, but retain the graph connections

Here's what I get using autoshape:
DavRd +I-595(7) http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.093326&lon=-80.226878
+x4u70-242472 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.091636&lon=-80.219567
FLTpk http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.090955&lon=-80.216621
+x4u70-330957 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.090340&lon=-80.214553
I-595(8) http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.089736&lon=-80.212522
+x4u70-944782 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.086680&lon=-80.206078
I-595(9) http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.085133&lon=-80.202816
+x4u70-449134 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.084385&lon=-80.199332
I-595(9C) http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=26.083900&lon=-80.197073
If you decide to remove, add or reposition any points, I can recalculate.

[rickmastfan67]

fl.i595: 8X -> 8A +8X (this leaves the current '8' as-is as both the 'express' and mainline ramps to the FL Turnpike each have the same number)

I also favor this.
As an aside, with the WB->NB ramp that doesn't have a counterpart in the main Exit 8 complex, one could make an (a weak?) argument for a One Point Per (rather unorthodox) Interchange treatment here. Not something I feel especially strong about; 2 points can work too.

Well, if I went with just 1 for FL-84, I would lose the graph connection with the Turnpike due to the ramp configuration.

Maybe zap Exit 9C on 1PPI grounds?

If I did that here, I'd have to do it to the Turnpike interchange too, as it's a shorter distance between the points as it is currently in the file.  I mean, the separate ramp from the I-595 EB mainline does help this out to keep it as a separate point from the one @ US-441.