UT: US 89 exit numbers in Ogden

[the_spui_ninja]

US 89 has posted exit numbers between I-84 and I-15 (in OpenStreetMap, field verified today).

[US 89]

And more are likely coming at some point, as that entire segment is getting upgraded to freeway status within the next few years.

[Duke87]

GMSV shows posted exit numbers 394, 395, 396, 397, 404, and 405.

That said I'm not sure it's necessarily appropriate to go ahead and start changing labels. The manual from CHM actively proscribes the use of exit numbers on US highways. Exceptions have been made, but usually only in cases where there is a lengthy freeway segment with consistently numbered exits.

I'm inclined to leave this as is but open to being convinced otherwise.

[Jim]

... The manual from CHM ...

TM's manual is now on the main site.

[neroute2]

I see no reason not to use exit numbers on any highway with consistent ones (e.g. not the Juarez beltway where they get out of sync because they don't skip numbers at partial interchanges).

[US 89]

395 to 405 are valid for sure. 394 gets messy, as that’s the exit to Legacy even though 89 hops onto I-15 as an unnumbered ramp there...I don’t really care what happens with that label.

I see no reason not to use exit numbers on any highway with consistent ones (e.g. not the Juarez beltway where they get out of sync because they don't skip numbers at partial interchanges).

Agreed. To use other area examples, US 89 as it is now is no different from a highway like UT 154 or UT 201, both of which currently have some nonfreeway segments but use any numbered exits that do exist as TM waypoints. This is how it should be done IMO.

I don’t understand why a highway shouldn’t use exit number waypoints just because it happens to have a US shield on it - what makes it any different from a state route freeway with numbered exits? And there is precedent to ignore this rule anyway - see US 60 on the Superstition Freeway in the Phoenix area and US 95 in Las Vegas.

It’s not like changing a label breaks anything, either - the existing labels can be kept as alternates without breaking any list files.

[the_spui_ninja]

I see no reason not to use exit numbers on any highway with consistent ones (e.g. not the Juarez beltway where they get out of sync because they don't skip numbers at partial interchanges).

Agreed. To use other area examples, US 89 as it is now is no different from a highway like UT 154 or UT 201, both of which currently have some nonfreeway segments but use any numbered exits that do exist as TM waypoints. This is how it should be done IMO.

I don’t understand why a highway shouldn’t use exit number waypoints just because it happens to have a US shield on it - what makes it any different from a state route freeway with numbered exits? And there is precedent to ignore this rule anyway - see US 60 on the Superstition Freeway in the Phoenix area and US 95 in Las Vegas.

It’s not like changing a label breaks anything, either - the existing labels can be kept as alternates without breaking any list files.

This is the case in Idaho as well, on US 20 east of Idaho Falls and on US 95 in the Panhandle. I don't think people will remember that (for example) they left US 89 at UT272/273, they'll remember they took Exit 397.

[Jim]

I was confused by this conversation until seeing in the TM waypoint labeling guidelines that the sentence is still there: "We don't use exit numbers on the US highways."  I believe it was settled long ago that we do use exit numbers when posted on highways of any type.  This was a change since the migration from CHM.

Unless I hear objections, I will remove that sentence from our guidelines.

[oscar]

^ I agree with that change, which makes interchange numbers "desired" (not mandatory) waypoint labels for all kinds of highways, rather than forbidden just for US routes.

[US 89]

UT272/273

UT 272 was decommissioned in 2001, so that label needs to change regardless

[Duke87]

Unless I hear objections, I will remove that sentence from our guidelines.

No objections from me. I don't think it really makes sense as a blanket proscription anyway.

Added in exit numbers 395, 396, 397, 404, and 405.

394 isn't made a label on account of 1PPI with I-15.