Author Topic: Georgia (Asia): Not in Asia  (Read 108 times)

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Offline jayhawkco

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Georgia (Asia): Not in Asia
« on: January 08, 2021, 08:26:26 am »
Sorry if this is me just being pedantic, but the country of Georgia is in Europe, not Asia.  Can we change how it's listed?

Side note, one of my favorite countries and it's where I proposed to my wife.

Chris

Offline dfilpus

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Re: Georgia (Asia): Not in Asia
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2021, 09:10:40 am »
To be even more pedantic, the border between Europe and Asia between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea is not well defined. Depending on the source, Georgia can be considered to be in Asia, in Europe, or split between the two continents.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia#/media/File:Possible_definitions_of_the_boundary_between_Europe_and_Asia.png

Offline si404

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Re: Georgia (Asia): Not in Asia
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2021, 10:16:54 am »
Sorry if this is me just being pedantic, but the country of Georgia is in Europe, not Asia.  Can we change how it's listed?
The current convention for the geographic boundary is the watershed of The Greater Caucasus Mountains. This map has the name of the mountain range along that watershed. Anything north of it is Europe - as you can see, it's not a lot of Georgia!


European Georgia is a tiny fraction of the country, with just one main road (S3/AH81/E117 north of somewhere around Kazbegi National Park) - there's more clinchable mileage in Asian Greece!

Now you may say "well it's politically European", but note that the key European political body it is in*, The Council of Europe, says: "Strictly speaking, the three South Caucasus States, Armenia, Azerbaijan and Georgia are located in Asia".

AFAICS, pushes to get Georgia seen as European are based on the idea that Asia is lesser. While Iran, Iraq and Syria (others that border Turkey) are not countries that Georgia wants to be associated with, and Ukraine, Bulgaria and Romania (others with Black Sea coast) ones it would, that doesn't make change geography that Georgia is almost entirely part of Asia. We can surely see Georgia as western-looking country without demeaning a whole continent.

*There's the UNECE, but that includes Tajikistan, Israel and Canada which are indisputably not part of Europe, and Georgia is also in UNESCAP, the Asia-Pacific sister entity, so we'll ignore that.

To be even more pedantic, the border between Europe and Asia between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea is not well defined.
To be even more pedantic, the border between Europe and Asia between the Black Sea and the Arctic Ocean is not a totally agreed upon thing, even though the boundaries chosen can be well defined. And none of the borders between 2500 years ago and 300 years ago involved the Caspian Sea.
Quote
Depending on the source, Georgia can be considered to be in Asia, in Europe, or split between the two continents.
Though the vast majority of sources in the last 2500 years have at least the vast majority of Georgia in Asia, and its only the recent convention that has the tiny bit in Europe. No source I've found claims it to be geographically in Europe.

Quote
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia#/media/File:Possible_definitions_of_the_boundary_between_Europe_and_Asia.png
The description of that map, with my bolding.
A map of possible definitions of the boundary between Europe and Asia.
Note that most of these lines are not referenced to any sources proposing them. The red line marked "A" is apparently the "Strahlenberg" definition commononly taught in Soviet-era Russia. See File:Historical Europe-Asia boundaries 1700 to 1900.png for a map which is actually based on references.

The modern mainstream definition used by the UN (see also this) are marked "B" (Urals and Ural River) and "F" (Caucasus watershed).

Lines C, D, E, G, H, I and J are currently without reference.

Red line - "Strahlenberg" border, allegedly also used by the International Geographical Union [1]
A: Ural Mountains-Emba River and Kuma Manych Depression (at Rivers Kuma, Manych and lower Don)
Orange lines - other variants of border:
B: Ural Mountains-Ural River (modern mainstream definition)
C: Yugorsky Strait Cape–Pay Khoy Mountains–Ural Mountains-Ural River
D: Ural Mountains-Kazakhstan Border
E: northern foothills of Caucasus
F: Lines on the Great Caucasus watershed (modern mainstream definition)
G: southern foothills of Caucasus
H: Meso-Caucasus at Rivers Rioni and Kura
I: Lines on the Lesser Caucasus and Rivers Araks and Kura
J: former Soviet Union border"


Lines F, G, H, I and J are the ones that cross Georgia. F is the one I show above, the others are all unsourced definitions.

Offline si404

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Re: Georgia (Asia): Not in Asia
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2021, 10:27:01 am »
I've changed the name to "Georgia (Caucasus)" as a fix.

Offline jayhawkco

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Re: Georgia (Asia): Not in Asia
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2021, 10:56:17 am »
I've changed the name to "Georgia (Caucasus)" as a fix.

Wow.  That was a lot of info I didn't know.   ;D

I just always considered it European if for no other reasons than they play European soccer and when I booked my flight to Tbilisi with frequent flyer miles, the mileage deducted was the North America -> Europe amount.

I'm good however you want to do it!

Chris