usaush: United States Historic US Routes

[Duke87]

Looking, it's 1PPIing the ramp between CA110 and N San Fernando Road with the pre-existing exit 26A point on CA110.

Came in here to point this out and yeah I think this is a case where we need to break the graph connection since keeping it makes the route trace for US99HisLos way too janky.

Relatedly, I think we need to break this route up into separate Los Angeles and San Fernando segments. Here's why:
- in Burbank, just north of MagBlvd, the old US 99 alignment no longer exists since a shopping mall has been built on top of it. There are no signs directing traffic around. Indeed... there are no historic US 99 signs anywhere in Burbank at all. The signs disappear after the Los Angeles/Glendale City line, which is at Tyburn Street a few blocks south of the GleBlvd point. So, US99HisLos should end there.
- there is another discontinuity in the route at the I-5(147) point where following it would require jumping up onto (northbound) or down off of (southbound) an overpass with no ramps connecting it to the road underneath. There are no historic US 99 signs between the two discontinuities. The next place they appear north of Burbank is at the Van Nuys Blvd intersection, so that (or the next point south depending on how you wish to interpret it) is where the south end of the San Fernando section should be.

[oscar]

Earlier today, I noticed several US 20 Historic signs in Sac County IA, along CRD36 between IA 471 and US 71. There's also a sign at the intersection with IA 471 indicating the historic route continues north along 471, though I didn't see any historic signage between CRD36 and present-day US 20, to indicate where the historic route goes.

This is just for information, in case I have an opportunity to add that segment of CRD36 to my list file (don't know whether adding it to usaush is warranted).

[SSOWorld]

You’re going to find them along the whole of Iowa eventually. Black Hawk, Buchanan, Delaware, and Dubuque counties are marked.

[si404]

Earlier today, I noticed several US 20 Historic signs in Sac County IA, along CRD36 between IA 471 and US 71. There's also a sign at the intersection with IA 471 indicating the historic route continues north along 471, though I didn't see any historic signage between CRD36 and present-day US 20, to indicate where the historic route goes.

This is just for information, in case I have an opportunity to add that segment of CRD36 to my list file (don't know whether adding it to usaush is warranted).

There's also US20 Historic signs along CRD36 at IA4 and US20 on GMSV.

You’re going to find them along the whole of Iowa eventually.

Indeed - and 'eventually' might be rather soon given the rate that the rest has been rolled out, and that Iowa has designated Historic US20 across the state as something more official - though anything is more official than 'guy selling signs did some ninja placement of signs for marketing purposes' as it was a few years ago! 

eg, here's some US20 Historic signs on GMSV further west than the 4 counties you mention atCorrectionville, Fort Dodge, Webster City, Iowa Falls and Ackley

[vespertine]

I had the opportunity to drive some of the old US20 route (using the maps at historicus20.com as a guide) while en route to clinch the rest US20 in Iowa. Travelling west from Ackley to IA471, I found the old US20 route decently signed with historic markers, and nearly all turns marked. The same cannot be said for the route from Cushing to Sioux City; while there were historic signs at the city limits of Cushing and Correctionville, no other signage appears present through this stretch. Take of this what you will, if you wish to include this route or not.

v.

[cockroachking]

IL US66HisChi:
The point IL29_S is in the Walgreens parking lot instead of the intersection, and is thus causing graph connection and concurrency issues with IL29 and I-55BLSpr.

[cl94]

I found a signed Historic US 50 this afternoon in Folsom, CA. 4 blocks of Sutter Street downtown, from the Folsom Blvd ramp to Riley Street. That is the extent of what was US 50 along Sutter Street, so it is correct. I saw no signs on either side of downtown.

[si404]

I found a signed Historic US 50 this afternoon in Folsom, CA. 4 blocks of Sutter Street downtown, from the Folsom Blvd ramp to Riley Street. That is the extent of what was US 50 along Sutter Street, so it is correct. I saw no signs on either side of downtown.

It's really strange they have the US50His signs, because the signs elsewhere in Folsom are Lincoln Highway* ones, of which there are none on Sutter Street.

Anyway, this short and isolated route has been added locally. I also looked elsewhere (Altamont Pass, Folsom Blvd in Sacramento) and found no other signed routes.

*A route, along with the Great River Road, is crying out to be added at some point!

[cl94]

I found a signed Historic US 50 this afternoon in Folsom, CA. 4 blocks of Sutter Street downtown, from the Folsom Blvd ramp to Riley Street. That is the extent of what was US 50 along Sutter Street, so it is correct. I saw no signs on either side of downtown.

It's really strange they have the US50His signs, because the signs elsewhere in Folsom are Lincoln Highway* ones, of which there are none on Sutter Street.

Anyway, this short and isolated route has been added locally. I also looked elsewhere (Altamont Pass, Folsom Blvd in Sacramento) and found no other signed routes.

*A route, along with the Great River Road, is crying out to be added at some point!

IMO, the Lincoln Highway and Great River Road are more worthy than some of the things we currently include (not that I endorse removing anything,  I'm on the "include as much as possible" train). Both are signed extremely well, sometimes better than state routes. In the case of the LH, it's often signed better than Old 40 and Old 50 in California/ Nevada and are functionally equivalent to historic US routes.

[osu-lsu]

Best to know your Lincoln Highways (yes, plural) then.
https://www.lincolnhighwayassoc.org/map/

[CoreySamson]

Is there any reason that US66HisTul was removed from the corpus that I'm not aware of? Just noticed that today.

EDIT: Just noticed the new US66HisOkl, consider my problem solved.

[si404]

Is there any reason that US66HisTul was removed from the corpus that I'm not aware of? Just noticed that today.

EDIT: Just noticed the new US66HisOkl, consider my problem solved.

Your travels on US66HisTul, and other routes absorbed by the extended US66HisOkl, should carry over. No update entries as the system is preview rather than active.

[the_spui_ninja]

I found a signed Historic US 50 this afternoon in Folsom, CA. 4 blocks of Sutter Street downtown, from the Folsom Blvd ramp to Riley Street. That is the extent of what was US 50 along Sutter Street, so it is correct. I saw no signs on either side of downtown.

It's really strange they have the US50His signs, because the signs elsewhere in Folsom are Lincoln Highway* ones, of which there are none on Sutter Street.

Anyway, this short and isolated route has been added locally. I also looked elsewhere (Altamont Pass, Folsom Blvd in Sacramento) and found no other signed routes.

*A route, along with the Great River Road, is crying out to be added at some point!

IMO, the Lincoln Highway and Great River Road are more worthy than some of the things we currently include (not that I endorse removing anything,  I'm on the "include as much as possible" train). Both are signed extremely well, sometimes better than state routes. In the case of the LH, it's often signed better than Old 40 and Old 50 in California/ Nevada and are functionally equivalent to historic US routes.

Lewis and Clark Trail too, there's a good online map for it (https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/87266b6613aa443cb437ef26c2077fff/) and it's really well signed in my experience.

[Duke87]

Regarding US66HisOkl: it is signed westbound as turning right off of NW 39th onto Penn Ave, and then turning left onto I-44. Eastbound is signed as following NW 39th from I-44 exit 124, as is mapped.

NW 39th is actually the historic alignment, the signed westbound jog on Penn is presumably for continuity's sake since if you proceed west on NW 39th you will find it becomes one-way eastbound a few blocks later and not be able to continue following it. Still, worth a note.


Also: there are several alignments of Historic US 66 signed in Oklahoma City. The one that is mapped is the original 1926 routing. But there are also signs posted for the 1930 alignment (39th-Western instead of 39th-Classen), 1933 alignment (May-23rd instead of 39th-Classen-23rd), 1931 Beltline (Western-Britton from 39th to Kelley), 1936 Beltline (Classen from 39th to Western) and 1947 Beltline (May-Britton from 39th to Kelley).

Since these are all signed I'd say they should all be mapped.

The city's tourism website has a handy map.

[si404]

Regarding US66HisOkl: it is signed westbound as turning right off of NW 39th onto Penn Ave, and then turning left onto I-44. Eastbound is signed as following NW 39th from I-44 exit 124, as is mapped.

NW 39th is actually the historic alignment, the signed westbound jog on Penn is presumably for continuity's sake since if you proceed west on NW 39th you will find it becomes one-way eastbound a few blocks later and not be able to continue following it. Still, worth a note.

I can't read the tiny text on the bottom of this sign (it's not there when I jump to the driveway, which is older imagery). There is no sign at I-44/Penn, but there is this one on I-44, which leads to this sign on 39th north of I-44, where 39th exists on both sides of I-44 as a couplet (which is one-way in the vicinity of I-44 exit 124, but otherwise 2 two-way frontage roads).

However, this westbound sign shows that westbound it remains on 39th south of I-44, and that sign at Penn is to get you around the one-way section at May, where, if travelling westbound on 39th (s of I-44) you'll find this sign telling you that there's a discontinuity in His66. I'd suggest that dinking down Frankford and along 38th to May before rejoining 39th just before it becomes the Expressway is 1PPI territory.

As such, I say keep it as is. Whether you count the (poorly) signed westbound diversion from Penn as a valid clinch of the route along 39th is up to the clincher.

Also: there are several alignments of Historic US 66 signed in Oklahoma City. The one that is mapped is the original 1926 routing. But there are also signs posted for the 1930 alignment (39th-Western instead of 39th-Classen), 1933 alignment (May-23rd instead of 39th-Classen-23rd), 1931 Beltline (Western-Britton from 39th to Kelley), 1936 Beltline (Classen from 39th to Western) and 1947 Beltline (May-Britton from 39th to Kelley).

Since these are all signed I'd say they should all be mapped.

Like this, you mean? (I've added links to the relevant routes in the quoted bit)